The “Water Cooler” is a feature on Claycord.com where we ask you a question or provide a topic, and you talk about it.
The “Water Cooler” will be up Monday-Friday at noon.
Today’s question:
A guaranteed basic income program may be coming to the city of Alameda next year. The City Council on May 17 will consider options for such a program, which is being piloted in some form in Oakland, San Francisco and Stockton, among dozens of other cities. Basic income programs provide a defined group of residents with a monthly cash payment that they can use to pay for anything they choose too. The payments occur for a defined period.
QUESTION: Do you think basic income programs are a good or bad idea? Tell us why.
Talk about it.
Not even close to a good idea. A good way to turn everyone needy. Give them a hand they take the arm.
@Ricardoh
+1
This depends on what a “defined group of residents” is. Yes to those who are trying to improve their lives and obtain an education, learn the language and stop being a burden to society. No to the lazy, entitled dregs of society. However, you still should have controls on what the funds can be spent on and work with the people to increase their financial literacy.
I thought the idea was to curb inflation, not make it worse?
@Janus
+1
Government loves inflation.
“Government loves inflation.” Perhaps it should be thought of as a transfer of wealth from citizens to government. The federal debt is somewhere around $20 trillion, and if they run an inflation to make every dollar worth only 50 cents, then the inflation adjusted value of that debt will only be $10 trillion. However, all of our money and savings will be cut in half also, so they basically take half our money and gives it to themselves. If someone did this to a liquor store they would be arrested.
Instead of a guaranteed income, why not a guaranteed job (for the income)?
@Nick
+1
Let’s see – beer money, drugs… Hmmm… what could go wrong?
If it comes with a guaranteed “job”, maybe. There is a lot of trash along our roadways that needs to be removed, for example.
@Bad Nombre
+1
It can be a good idea. It has it’s pro’s can con’s. It might help elderly people who no longer can work due to age or health, especially if their social security is low, which often happen to women, because they might have spend years not working, due to staying home with their children.
It also depends how people use it. If they just sit back and watch TV all day, not a good idea. If the money is used to get training and education that would result in a better paying job, that would be good. Living paycheck to paycheck makes it hard for people to get ahead. Years ago when I decided to get my insurance license, I was only able to do it because, I had other income and a low mortage. Insurance can be lucrative, but it is commission only so it often takes some time to build a business. Some insurance forward commissions, others do not. I sold long term care insurance and didn’t get paid until the policy was approved and delivered, which might take as little as 3 weeks, or as long as 3 months. Anyway just handing money out without a means test is not a good idea. Also if someone do use the money to get more training and a better paying job, then when they earn more the guaranteed income should then stop. I think most people want to make it on their own and be productive. However, there is always someone who will try to take advantage of whatever they can.
@hanne
There are no Pro’s to this.
People have been abusing the welfare system for decades. The welfare system is designed to be temporary and get people up on their feet.
However, it has turned into a career path for knuckle heads.
Another give away program that the taxpayers are going to have to pay for-therefore it’s a redistribution of wealth program. Get it straight: socialism doesn’t work.
Hanne said it in her assessment, “It also depends how people use it”.
Thank-you for making my point.
Life is full of choices. If you stay home to raise kids, that is your choice. Whys should others pay for it? This might work in small, more homogenous countries like Sweeden, but not in America where leeches are looking for a handout as a way of life. Plus, all these programs are always touted as temporary when they end up being anything but!
This is how a totalitarian state takes hold. Ukraine has a similar system – a digital passport that includes applications for government grants, a vaxx passport and a social credit score.
They say you can use the funds for anything you like but eventually there will be conditions…no vaxx, no money. Low social credit score, no money. You can buy whatever you want but only at the approved stores.
HORRIBLE IDEA.
We are talking Government incompetence here…….so all of the burquah wearing imports will be free loading off of the system. No Encouragement to better themselves other than breeding like rabbits.
Of course giving people free money will have positive impacts for the recipient.
More bribery so the Democrats get votes while people who work for a living get the bill.
Totally agree.
The first step to total Socialism.
TERRIBLE idea. This money comes from somewhere…it was taken from some taxpayer(s) and distributed to the recipient. Its just wealth redistribution under a different name.
If people need income, they should WORK for it.
Yep. Life is about choices. We need to stop rewarding people for making selfish ones so they get off not working.
So, another form of welfare paid by the taxpayers?
Always wondered why they call it welfare when it is not Fair at all.
I know how the regular SS is suppose to work. Pay into for most of your life and hope to collect it back again if you don’t die first. I don’t know how the SSI works since that is a different kind for some disabled people I believe.
But guaranteed income would need perimeters. People being human means some will benefit properly and others will squander it.
HORRENDOUS idea.
.
.. another left-wing welfare program.
Not a good idea, not even close. Pure redistribution of wealth. taking money from the producers to gift to the takers (this is a generalization, it does not apply to each and every person…). Too many (and I have known many) who would gladly hold their hand out, while making no effort to find a job, let alone a career. Then, the next complaint will be that the basic amount is not a “living wage” and they would need more. And as the horrible icing on this dreadful cake, let us not forget how this state has demonstrated how diligent they would be to prevent fraud.
Jeff, You say you have known many who would gladly accept any handout. Are these your friends or family? Among my many friends and acquittances and can only think of one that seem to have an eversion to work. She worked at times, but stayed home with her 2 daughters when they were small even though she couldn’t afford. Then worked in a bank, decided to get a college degree to get a better job, worked as a waitress to pay bills. Graduated with honors, but never used her degree, always said she couldn’t find the right job, or that certain jobs were beneath someone with a degree. Off course those job often leads to better jobs, you have to start somewhere.
BAD idea… another handout that just enables the lazy people to continue to be lazy and expect everything be handed to them without lifting a finger…. the “entitled” syndrome funded 🙁
This program has pluses and minuses. It’s a long list.
Giving people money to help them get back on their feet is good if they are obliged to pay the money back.
Giving money to the perpetual ner do wells and permanent welfare seekers is not good. It allows people to be irresponsible and unaccountable.
A strong and free society is where people are accountable and responsible.
What form of society do the people want?
My vote is for the latter.
What we know now is our current economic system is NOT working! It is out-of-balance. There was much to be learned from the pandemic and stimulus payments and shutdown of businesses.
Some people who were laid off their jobs learned that they weren’t doing what they really wanted to do in life. Others determined that they didn’t want to put in 80 hour weeks just to make some already rich people richer.
Annual basic income is an idea that has been around for some time. We have the ability to automatic jobs that humans hate doing and shouldn’t be doing. I recall before the pandemic that people were asking where were the jobs? Well, all the work that needed to be done was being done. That situation can occur, after all. So what do you do then?
Of course the pandemic hit and after a while when businesses opened up again we learned that many people didn’t want to go back to meaningless jobs again. There is problem #2.
Maybe think of annual basic income as a form of insurance. Because if people fall through the cracks then we all wind up paying for that. So there is probably a reasonable form of annual basic income so no one need go homeless, starve or suffer poverty. But first you need a reasonable government, not one controlled by oligarchs like we have now. We have too many obscenely wealthy people (think Bill Gates who acts like an 8 year old). We could cap wealth but try to sell that to Saudi Princes. They want control but are way out-of-touch with the public.
And don’t ask me what I have against “successful people”. These people aren’t just successful they are “money junkies!”
@Captain Bepops
We remember events quite differently. Before the pandemic, there were employers wondering where all the workers were….job openings were everywhere. The economy was booming. Yet, you said you remember people asking where were the jobs. Then you said that after businesses opened up again, people didn’t want to go back to meaningless jobs. I believe the reason was not that the jobs were meaningless….it’s because Biden was paying them more to stay home.
And I disagree with you about having too many obscenely wealthy people. Not one thing wrong with being wealthy. And in spite of what that idiot Liz Warren and that idiot Biden say, the ultra-rich DO pay their fair share.
If the government has so much extra money laying around that it can just hand stacks of it to selected people like this then that is a sign they’re taxing us too much and should cut taxes. Put money back in everyone’s wallet that way.
Government giving financial support becomes an entitlement to the receiver. Never enough or long enough for them .
BAD! Nothing says failure any better than rewarding people for doing nothing. Just look at the generations of welfare and other entitlements. These feel good programs don’t work because there is usually no time constraints added to them. It almost becomes second nature to have the money arrive into your debit card and or account on the first of every month with no expiration. One year turns into 5, 10, 20 and life for doing nothing.
I am not in favor of universal income for several reasons. One is that it turns the society into us working for the government who will take the role of parent to distribute things evenly. I think the government should work for us, and not be our parent. Second, I don’t like the ethics of taking money from those who do work. Its theft if it just pays for those who voted to confiscate money from them, really no different than a liquor store holdup. I looked up the Wikipedia on this and the video shows that freed from the burden of working a job, those on welfare will contribute their skills as artists and volunteers. Really. That is the pink unicorn Leftist fantasy world. More likely it will be like the people who used to live next to me that spent their time socializing and earning extra income through drug sales.
@To Do List….At least your neighbors weren’t squirting simian babies every year to get more welfare money to get new cars, new furniture, or whatever she wants. My neighbor is 25 with 5 kids with 4 different fathers. Of course her mother raises most of her offspring and the last “baby’s daddy” lives there playing video games and sleeping all day. Their yard makes George Sanford’s yard look like a landscaping paradise….I could go on and on but you get the idea. Oh, and BTW…there are Facebook pages that are dedicated on how to get all the money and perks they “deserve” from the state and federally, my neighbor brags about it I hear through the grapevine.
Oh. He’ll. No!!!!
As the proverb says, Give a man a fish or teach a man to fish. Oh! This is CA. Give. Give. Give. NO incentive to become independent. Tired of my taxes going to such nonsense.
There are some very smart people out there telling of A.I. robots taking over 90 percent of all jobs … I believe it. They also are predicting A.I. will advance technology 50,000 years in a single generation via self learning … I believe that too. So when you consider this all … there is some merit in this idea, me thinks.
As I stated earlier, I’m not for handing out money to just everyone, especially if they don’t use the money to get training or education so they can get a better job. However, what JoJo is saying is what I have heard from those to predict the future (futurist they are called) I believe they don’t have a political agenda, they just state what they believe will become reality in the future.
Check out this quote from an amazing man who knew the score:
“For even when we were with you, this we commanded you, If any will not work, neither let him eat.”
He was a traveling educator from a long time ago, in a land far away. (Still seems applicable today)
The Little Red Hen?
Help those who help themselves
This is a horrible idea because it doesn’t promote the desire to get a job. The current system works: people get a job, if the monthly income isn’t enough to support the person or person’s family and the monthly income is below the federal poverty guideline, then there is welfare to supplement the income for basically need (like healthcare or food). At the end of the year, the person file the tax, the person get some money back.
Horrible idea. This is not what the United States is about or ever should be. We are not a socialist country. We will help those who are in need but everyone is expected to pull there own weight. Otherwise all of us who work hard are paying taxs to cover those who live off of the system. And once in place it will only spread like a disease and kill the will of a lot of people that other wise would atleast try to work to make there own living to just taking the handout and putting more of a strain on the system. We need these democrats out of office before the do more damage to this state and country.
This is literal redistribution of wealth.
the concept of universal basic income is really fascinating to me, but it seems like artificially infusing cash into the economy will result in more inflation, when we should be doing anything possible to curb it. In the hands of our local and state politicians, I don’t trust it at all – they will simply be pay off specific segments of society for being a reliable voting base.
To quote Dean Wormer of Faber College:
“Fat, dumb, and stupid is no way to go through life son.”
I believe Wormer’s exact words were:
“Fat, drunk, and stupid is no way to go through life son.”
Love the movie “Animal House”. It was hardly politically correct, especially the fat part. Tim Matheson was almost a dead ring for an old boyfriend of mine.